Damian Whitworth
2 for 1 tickets to Casablanca, this coming Monday

No. One of the shortest, easiest, most used words in the English language. It can also be one of the hardest to utter in any meaningful way – particularly if you are a modern parent. Those who work with children believe that a generation of parents have forgotten how to say no, with the result that as their children grow up they lack the self-control needed to negotiate adult life successfully.
“Children need to have the experience of an adult saying no,” says Jane Cassidy of the Association of Child Psychotherapists and joint chair of the Child and Adolescent Psychotherapist Division of the Tavistock Society. “If you always give in, they don’t learn that somebody can stay firm, so when they become young teenagers and adults they don’t have the capability to say no to themselves when they are under peer pressure in terms of drugs, delinquency or sex.” The problem, teachers, psychologists and parents agree, is that when it comes to discipline, parents are hopelessly ill-disciplined. They tell their children that they should not do something or cannot have something that they want, but cave in to the child’s protests.
Dr Tanya Byron, clinical psychologist and Times2 columnist, says that dealing with this issue has become “the spine of my clinic. The majority of people I see really can’t say no to their children or can’t set boundaries. They can’t follow through to a consequence after saying ‘no’. Children don’t have a sense of who is in charge so they take charge themselves.”
The effect of parental ineffectiveness is all too obvious in society – nowhere more so than in schools. Earlier this year I spent a week at Banbury School, a comprehensive in Oxfordshire, shadowing the head teacher, Dr Fiona Hammans, a dynamic and nationally respected teacher who has been responsible for the education and wellbeing of thousands of children. She had no doubts about where many of the school’s discipline problems originated.
“You’ve got a generation of parents that does not believe in punishing their kids. They say ‘you’re grounded for a year’. And the kid cries and then they say ‘Oh all right, then!’ A whole lot of parents don’t know how to control their kids. The kids are in charge.” Hammans certainly does know how to say no, and back it up. But her point was that what she said was far less important than what parents said and did. Hammans even described the extraordinary situation where parents were not attending parent-teacher evenings because “kids don’t want their parents coming up here”.
Jane Cassidy says that much of the rot set in relatively recently with “the whole idea of positive affirmation: trying to say yes, trying to avoid saying “no” to children because of the negativity”. Byron concurs, saying that our collective failure with the no word is a “huge change” from the situation when she first started working in the field 18 years ago. One of the chief reasons for this change, she believes, is that in the hurly-burly of the modern world we don’t want to spend what precious time we have with our children acting tough.
“We are very busy. In a lot of families where there are two parents, both work and they don’t want to come home at night and have to tell the children what to do. Or they are too bloody knackered to follow through with the discipline and so say ‘fine, do that, eat that’.” Food is one of the key battlegrounds. “Children have the most restricted diets because parents seem incapable of not giving in to what children want.” But according to Andrea Clifford-Poston, author of When Harry Hit Sally, by saying no to your children you are helping them to learn “not only that there are boundaries between you and them, but also how to put boundaries around themselves and other people”. Saying no, she explains, helps children to learn who we can say no to, when we can say no, why to say no and when we can stop saying no.
“If your children are going to have a good life, then they need to understand some of the rules about human beings being together,” she writes.
“If your child has learnt in the early years that you are someone who has clear and firm ideas about how you expect them to behave, and mean what you say and say what you mean, but don’t withdraw your love when your child has made a mistake, then you have built a solid foundation for the more complex years to come.”
Byron believes that the increasing isolation of parents is a crucial factor in how control over children has eroded. “Extended families don’t exist in the way that they used to and so many parents lack the wisdom and support of the older generation.” She also believes that parents feel under pressure to be seen to be raising well-behaved kids. “Parents are anxious not to be seen with unhappy children, so they negotiate and cajole in any way possible to avoid tantrums.
“We have forgotten what it is to be children. It is acceptable to have temper tantrums. Young children are supposed to be defiant. It’s in the job description. They are learning the rules of the game. Let them have a tantrum. Eventually they will learn that when you say ‘no’ it means ‘no’.”
Then there is the modern, highly risky need to be friends with our children. I recently received the following e-mail lament from a friend, a mother of two. “Parents have this warped view of parenting,” she wrote. “They don’t really want to be parents. They want to be down with their kids, to be popular with them. That’s why you have these scenarios of parents picking fights with teachers and encouraging children to do the same: the teachers are the enemy, the boring/repressive authority figures. That’s also why you see parents dressing the same as kids. I am forever seeing families in Wagamama, boy and dad in boardshorts, Converse and logo T-shirts, mum and girl in combats, Crocs and logo T-shirts. The thinking has to be: ‘We are too young and with it to be bossy authority figures, aren’t we? Better to be MATES with the kids and listen to the same music and watch Doctor Who together or fight over the PlayStation.’ I am surrounded by people who seem to treat parenting as a popularity contest. The thought of their child disliking them, however briefly, is very frightening.”
Cassidy agrees: “A lot of parents just want their children to like them. There’s nothing wrong with that but a lot of parents seem to think that you can negotiate with children. You can’t negotiate with a two-year-old. They don’t have the cognitive skills we have. Sometimes you have to get to the point where you say ‘because I told you so and I’m daddy and that’s just the way it is’. You can take time to explain but they have to understand that when you say no, you mean no. They need rules and consequences. They have to learn that if dad says no to something and they still do it, something will happen that they won’t like.”
Or as a friend who is a child psychologist likes to put it: “No negotiation with terrorists.” Cassidy says that parents’ behaviour is often confused by their own childhood experiences. “For example, if they hated school and a child expresses concerns about going to school, the parents’ feelings become muddled up in the child’s feelings.” Her basic strategy for parents who have lost control is to focus on what aspect of the behaviour they want most to change. “If they think that everything is going wrong, they need to start with the worst problem. So you might say ‘we are going to stop the hitting’ and state what the consequences will be for the child if they continue. They get a warning, they know what is going to happen and then if it continues, you remove a toy. But it is important that the consequence is something the child cares about. Parents say ‘I can’t stop him going to football because that’s what he really loves’, but that’s the whole point. It has to make sense, and then you can have a lot of fun with children once you know what the rules are. Children like knowing what the rules are.”
Byron suggests that where many parents go wrong is in their attitude to dealing with unruly behaviour: “It’s not about discipline, it’s about respect. Parents don’t want their kids to hit but they smack them, which I think is bonkers. They don’t want them to shout or scream, but they shout or scream at them. We should be role models.”
Cassidy agrees that actions speak louder than words: “Children don’t necessarily listen to words. You can say ten times ‘I love you’ but if you are not there they don’t feel they are important.”
It may sound funny coming from professionals, but both Byron and Cassidy believe that one of the burdens for parents is that they are presented with too much information. Byron feels this so strongly that her next book on children will be her last. “A lot of parents feel overloaded by information and disempowered,” she says. “We have got to get to a situation where parents feel empowered to do what they want to do. That may be something that an expert says, but you can do whatever you want as long as it works for you.”
Cassidy says that it is unhelpful for parents to think that there is a right or a wrong way of doing things. “I try to talk to parents about what their instinctive sense of parenting is. They need to have a confidence in themselves and their own sense of authority. If there was a totally right way, there would only be one book, there wouldn’t be hundreds and hundreds of books. We are all different.”
These are encouraging words for parents. The ‘yes’ generation should be able to learn to say ‘no’ again. But as any parent knows, it’s not what you say, but the way that you say it. And say it. And say it. And say it . . .

When was the last time you said no to your child?
“He wanted a magazine but I had bought him one the day before,”
— Sally, 49, on her eight-year-old son.
“This morning when my son appeared at 2am and said he couldn’t sleep and could we have a chat. I picked him up by the hair – well, almost – and took him into the bathroom and gave him a real talking to. Then I couldn’t get back to sleep anyway and neither could my wife,”
— Ian, 40, father of four.
“Rose dropped her school bag on the ground so she could use her skipping rope. When it came to leave the playground, she said ‘pick up my school bag’. I said no. If she’d said ‘please’ I might have considered it!”
— Angela, 35, mother of Rose, aged 5.
“Yesterday, he tried to avoid going to after-school club by pretending to be ill. I had to make him go,”
— Rebecca, single mum, 27, on her six-year-old son.
“I should have said no this morning when my son climbed into bed at 5.40am. But at that time the daunting prospect of wrestling him, a bear and a monkey back into his own bed outweighed concerns about weak parenting. So I budged up and went back to sleep,”
— Edward, 38, father of two.
“I said no to the puppy. But somehow that was translated as yes,”
— Ben, 43, father of three – and new dog owner.
“Last week at the cinema. Sam, who’s 8, demanded a sack of M&Ms. When I said no, he started screaming and refused to leave the cinema. To my shame I caved in.”
— John, 43, divorced father of three.
“I didn’t let my daughter go to the local shop on her own. London isn’t safe any more for a young girl,”
— Charlotte, 39, on her ten-year-old daughter

The problem stays with us as adults . . .
In modern workplaces, where there are no problems, only opportunities, the words we want to hear must be relentlessly positive affirmations of our general superbness. Saying “no”, or even being lukewarm, is tantamount to corporate thought crime. It’s like the old Stalinist era, when the first person in the audience to stop clapping the leader would be taken out and shot. It’s evident in our conversations, which are blighted by superlative inflation: instead of saying “fine” or “good”, we say “excellent” and “fantastic”.
We’re all desperate to sing from the same hymn sheet, even if the song is nonsense. Corporate “yessing” follows us home, too: if we absolutely must go on a holiday, we will take our BlackBerries, just in case someone wants us to agree with them from the other side of the globe. But this “yessing” makes us less productive.
Meetings are characterised by everyone agreeing with everyone else (after all, you don’t want to be the only one who questions your boss’s “brilliant” idea) so even the most ludicrous ideas get rubber-stamped. There’s no little boy pointing at the emperor’s clothes. Which is how we end up with things such as the Millennium Dome. And it’s not just people lower down the food chain who can’t say no – superiors are often loath to criticise employees openly. Instead of saying, “You are a lazy disgrace”, they feel compelled by relentless positivism to say: “Your work has been creative, inspiring, original – could we just have more of it, please?”
— JOHN NAISH
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I don't think the problem is about saying no. I think the problem is about following through with the action. Most parents are quite capable of saying No, and having a long conversation with their child about why they are saying no. The difficult thing is to then follow through and ignore the tantrum, drop everything and actually 'go straight home'.
On the other hand, I think being friends and having fun with your kids IS very important, whatever you are wearing.
kirstie, london,
"Parents are our role models for God" - Fight Club
If our gods do not respect authority - how can we?
As the superstitious age of eternal subjugation passes and the age of communal empowerment dawns - where does the path of our parents' attitude to "Authority" lead us to?
If we are raised as equals - and with responsibility to no higher agent, what shall we understand of duty, restraint and sacrifice?
If our parents are enslaved to the tyranny of the self - shall that not be our god too?
Is there a middle path between the unquestioned superstitions of arkenaten's monotheisms and the nihilism of self gratification?
Yorkshire zen, Huddersfield,
As a Mentor in a mainstrean primary school , I consider myself in a posistion to comment on the "say NO" issue. I wholeheartedly agree that parents these days are scared to be seen as controversial. Worse is that many believe that school is where discipline begins and ends; that staff
"daren't " or "can't" handle their children. We can. We do. We will. Within three days of being in my post I had been seriously assaulted by a 10 year old who didn't care who he hurt whilst in his rage.School has finished for the summer and I have had the joy of receiving cards, flowers, gifts and thanks from children and their parents expressing their gratitude for "being there" for them all. My role is not to be liked. I talk honestly and openly with young people, hoping to encourage them to be the best they can be. Parents MUST take that responsibilty too... I am tired of parents critisising schools. Parents are the key. It's time we had compulsory parenting classes, or the pyramid will collapse.
Val, Leeds, West Yorkshire
Off course parents can wear modern clothes and play computer games with their children if they want to but sometimes they need to be their parent and not their chidren's best friend. In my opinion children do need clear and consistent boundaries and to hear the word no but this does not have to be at the expense of and should not interfere with the fun times that parents have with their children.
Personally I can not have children but I have a very loving, fun and close relationship with my nieces even though I do say 'no' on a regular basis. In fact I say no because I do love them so very much. The other day my three year old niece was following me around screaming 'I don't like you' and having a tantrum because I had said no about something, 5 minutes later we were laughing, cuddling and sharing a story I may have been the wicked witch or auntie for those few minutes but she still loves me and knows I can be so much fun as well.
Tracey, Harlow, Essex
did it not go through your head that parents may CHOOSE to play with their children on the playstation as a form of interaction, and wear modern clothes because they WANT to? Parenthood isn't about authoritarian dictatorships or preening children or 'maturing' them. It's about bloody fun and laughs and developing personalities, how can a child develop a personality if they are forever being pandered into doing what YOU want them to do?
HR, Leeds,
Parents need to be consistent. Sayiing "No" and not meaning it, or following it through gives out a signal- and children will take advantage of that. Of course it's easier to say "Yes" - no one likes confrontation- but it's a short term gain. Most parents who can't say no lack confidence in themselves as parents- and fear they'll lose their child's love f they say no. It's natural for children to push against boundaries- but that doesn't mean that the boundaries should't be there. Without boundaries they end up confused- and with no clear picture of who they are or what they stand for.
Glynis Kozma, Herts,
I completely agree with this article: in shops, parks, even outside schools it is always possible to see parents who are unable to say "no" to their children. Or they shout and scream "no" until the kids just stop listening. Either way, same effect.
I'd like to think I've been brought up understanding the difference between "yes" and "no". Now, as a 17 year old, I do try to push the limits (of course!), but when my parents say no and give me a reason, I'll understand that if I do it then I'll be in trouble after.
I actually think that parents and their children should learn to communicate better with each other. Alot of children/teenagers have a new tactic: Lie. If the parents' answer is likely to be "no" with no reason other than "Because I said so", then the child will lie. The child needs to understand that if they are told "no", that there has to be a valid reason for it.
Sarah, Bristol,
Why is the in the Women section? Aren't men parents too?
Anyway, I completely agree with this, especially with the bit about parents wanting to be mates with their children. We have an argumentative 2 year-old and we would never get anything done, and he would never eat or sleep or go out, if he had his way. Certain sanctions actually do work. And as for dads looking like their children: well, it's embarrassing. There has to be some sort of separation otherwise eventually there will be no respect.
Will Duffay, London,
Using "no" with care, meaning it when you say it, and then sticking by your decison are keys to making it work. Inconsistency and giving into tantrums lead to disaster.
James, Jacksonville, Illinis
We live next door to a child (aged 8 or so) who is the most badly behaved I have ever met. He likes banging things - hitting a tree or a large metal gate - over and over and over again. This is when he is not tormenting his sister. They have both been allowed to scream for what seems like hours on end. All this has been going on since they moved in 4 years ago. It totally spoils our experience of being in the garden when they are at home; we even have to close the house windows if we are inside and they are in their garden.
His parents are nice people and we do not want to complain. We have overheard some of the things they have said to the boy, and know that they too find his behaviour difficult, but feel powerless.
Please parents - try to think of how your child's behaviour affects others, and how it reflects on you.
lin, wales,
I must be totally heartless, as I have no trouble saying "no". And the thing about saying "no" is that after a while, you don't have to say it that often anymore (because they realise that they can't have the sweeties in the shop, ever, so they'll stop asking).
I was also evil enough to ignore tantrums (my son tried it a couple of times and gave up).
You do have to SAY it, though. Preferably in a low tone. Shouting doesn't work.
starling, Lancaster,
Bringing up children properly is probably one of the most rewarding things that you can do but is very difficult , stressful and expensive but most importantly you have to grow up yourself and this is probably why so many people in our adolescent society are making a complete balls up of it.
jerym eedy, caerphilly, U.K.
It's easy to blame parents, but there is a whole industry based on the whine factor, from supermarkets strategically placing chocolates at the tills, to targeted marketing of junk food, movies, toys... My children, 5 and 9, have never eaten McDonalds, or chocolate (that I am aware of), sit down at 7pm to dinner and at 7am to breakfast, and will feel my belt against their backsides if they ever talk back to me or my wife. Nevertheless, we fight an ongoing battle against marketing companies who assail our kids' sense with glossy and sparkly things designed to make them bad. Teachers are little better, afraid to take control, which is why we now homeschool. Still, we feel threatened by an intrusive world that seems set on undermining our children's well-being,
Mike, London,
Andrew Milner - great post. Your idea actually worked for me in a roundabout way. After 3½ years of playing "surrogate" mum to my boyfriend's child I have been put off having them for life ;-)
Trouble was, the kid was great when he was with someone who understood the concept of non-negotiation and the word "no" (me) but an absolute demon whenever he was with his father (mum not particularly interested in taking active part in child's upbringing). Of course, when I pointed out the flaws in capitulating to said child's every whim and not setting any boundaries, I was labelled "resentful" and told, "What would you know about it? You've never HAD a child.". Of course, what would I know?
N Butler, London, UK
" I grabbed him by the hair"-oh very clever, hope you're proud. I find it amazing that my friends aged 18 and 19 at giving birth have managed to raise perfectly well-behaved disciplined but yet hugely loved toddlers, while still working and with no support from the partner who disappeared. If they can do it so well, then why are the 40 something rich north londoners finding it so bloody hard. Get a grip.
HR, Leeds,
The section commenting on parents being 'friends with their children' hits home - as a mutual friend described my ex wife, upon our divorce. She could not understand that you have to lay the lines down as to behaviour and acceptability, thus I became the 'bad guy' to both mother and offspring - it was anything for her to be 'buddy buddy' with them. Now they have become abusive teenagers, she has reaped her own sowing, and cannot handle them. Whatever age, whatever in life, we have to know the boundaries of our actions.
Steely Dan, Eastbourne,
I cant understand parents these days . Moms are tearing themselves apart in the kitchen actually asking what their offspring "want to eat" and end up disheing up separate meals with a lot a junk food just to be able to pander to faddy behaviour. Meals should be cooked and every one expected to it without all this silly behaviour. If they dont like it then tough, they dont eat until the next meal with no crisps, biscuits cakes of whatever inbetween.. . As to the chap with the horror in the cinema, did it ever occur to him to grab the brat and leave????????
Mrs Marian Oakley, Abbeyfeale Limerick, Rep. of Ireland
I was on the Paris Metro last week, and a British couple got on with a young boy and girl--perhaps 5 and 9 or thereabouts. Both children grabbed the pole I was holding, collapsed onto the floor, and began to scoot in circles around the pole, bumping into my legs and bouncing up and down in a most annoying fashion. The parents initially ignored them. Then the father said, "Don't you want to show respect for other people?" The children ignored this. Then the mother said, "Up or down but not around." The children ignored this and continued to spin and bounce. Finally my stop arrived and I was able to get off, bumping into and tripping over these children in the process. Had I done this as a child, my mother or father would have yanked me to my feet at once and told me in no uncertain terms that I was to behave properly. I have never seen such parental incompetence and disrespect for others. These children will grow up to be failures.
Joan M. Rogers, Boulder Creek, California, USA
How can it be in the interests of the child, or society as a whole, if children believe that they should continually get their own way?
Your author blames parents' desire to be 'mates' with their kids, and fear of being unpopular as the reason for weak discipline. Additionally the whole industry of child protection, coupled with child centered theories has led to a form of paralysis, and a loss of authority. We are now told that shouting at or criticising our children is wrong (never mind physical punishment) and may constitute abuse. Social services are bound by law to respond to intervene if the children say they are being hit or restrained (but as parents we are also told we are obliged to control our children's behaviour). As the law stands, if my teenager assaults me I am not allowed to hit back or physically defend myself. The situation is even worse for teachers.
Can we not accept that it is ok for kids to be disappointed, bored, ignored, or screaming for 5 minutes or so?
JP, London,
No is the hardest word these days. Parents endlessly shout at their kids who then switch off because they hear it all the time. I often wonder why people have kids as you often see kicking,screaming, yelling brats with their parents completely ignoring them as I did at Rome airpost last year. I would agree that parents have atough time these days but abdicating responsibility isn't the way out.
Relentless positivity at work - not where I am. Relentless negativity more like.
carole, London, UK
at last some commonsense no can be the most loving word in the world as in no I love you too much to let you take that riskor no you can't have more sweets/biscuits your teeth/health is too inportant to me
gillian millington, stafford,
I found it surprisingly easy to say "no" once I have said it for the first time. I know that if I "cave in" it will make my life more difficult in the future. My three year old is usually connvinced now the first time I say "no"; the 18 month old is still learning!
If you only say "no" when you do mean it and then you stick to your guns, everyone knows where they are.
Rachel Smith, Swindon,
Hang on Dr Byron - I appreciate that you're qualified to remark on the interpersonal relationships between parents and children, and maybe you're right that some people might find it easier to be popular with their children than to be 'parents'. However, your qualification doesn't necessarily give you the right to pass off your personal opinion of people and their habits (restaurant/sartorial) as gospel and examples of a greater malaise. Thats an insult to my intelligence.
Matthew Sumner, Strasbourg, France
Think I was on to a winner back in the '90's with my rent-a-brat programme. Having a child is like jumping out of a plane; you don't know exactly how it will work out and there's no going back. So to check if being a parent is really right for you, you get to take care of someone else's kid for a couple of weeks. The birth parents get to take a brat-free holiday, so I assumed this would be a win-win notion. Imagine the kid-for-a-fortnight experience would put a lot of young couples off the idea for life. Never quite got the idea off the ground. Insurance was the problem as I recall.
Hey, where's your sense of humour, Infidels?
Andrew Milner, Yokohama, Kanagawa